A space for conversations in a time of global disruption
Hi Malcolm. Part of the problem seems to be that to few people take part in discussions. If they did it might make for a more balanced discussion. Of course the slanging that goes on is quite possibly putting people of. The other side is that individuals might feel that what they see as very negative postings need to be challenged. You are left with going round in what could be described as a vicious circle. Perhaps a series of yellow and red cards like in football? If anybody has the stamina to take on such a task. Even that gives me pause for thought, do we really want any censorship?
there is the same solution to the problems of discussion as there is to the problems of the world ... having a moderator has been proven NOT to work because the closed-minded bullies of this world love the position of power where they determine who shall say and who shall be censored ... are happy to put in the hours feeling important simply shutting out anyone who disagrees with them ... one ends up with an appeal process which is just as inadequate , becomes like a martial court where the outcome is simply that the admin support the moderator , just as the 'government' support the police , right or wrong ...
a loving community , as in fact God points out, needs a place for the unloving to live their way and see it is worse ... the site needs to be set up this way , with a place for discussion of the points raised and another for those who get their kicks insulting each other and getting nowhere ... a 'sin bin' if you like ... and the simple rule is that if you don't stick to the rule that one discusses only topics, not members, then the topic part of the site is denied and one can go slang others wh like to slang where it doesn't disrupt discussion ... can come back when one undertakes to discuss instead of slanging others ... simple, easy to manage, and a learning process about respect for others who happen to still disagree ... the decision is not hard as to whether one is talking about members in derogatory way and could be taken by the site owner alone or by say three folks agreeing in a simple automatic voting system ... increasing the number of votes automatically required as the site grows ... and putting anyone in the sin bin [or banning them] if they give false votes ... in particular the sin bin is NOT censorship , the offender is allowed a voice on a special appeal thread in the bin... this system eliminates the ability of moderators to silence any criticism of their moderation, prevents the system corrupting folks as happens in the real world and on moderated sites... gets around theproblem of censorship and of folks whose only 'argument' is to slang anyone who disagrees with their current views, stops discussions coming to a halt even when only one person wants to slang for attention to their pain in life ...
Yes, I am a problem for you,
stranger: You are a problem for everyone because your only words are personal abuse of folsk with whom you have decided you disagree.... you filled the site with abusive words and yet you don't even rad the explanatin of your MISTAKEN BELIEFS about what I believe ... your ranting attacks are not only of no interest to ANYONE HERE , but you are not even ranting about me because you have a FALSE IMAGE of what I believe and won't even listen to the explanation of YOUR MISTAKES ...
wolfbird :I can see that, because I object to the fact that you have never discussed anything with anybody here.
stranger: I have discussed some points with a few insofar as I have been allowed to do so, but your senseless ad hominem attacks on everything I say make it impossible for anyone to continue discussion here, you are preventing ALL discussion here with volumes of sheer irrelevant abusive nonsense of no use to anyone
wolfbird : You use the place as if it was your own website, a platform for your preaching, and poetry publishing, and to promote your own peculiar religious beliefs.
stranger: I publish my poetry on gspoetry.com not here , so again you are mistaken in extreme , but there is no reason not to use poetry here, many have done so with no complaint from anyone, not even you ... and ths is a discussion site, it is a place for folks to put forth new and old views on the issues raised by DM ... everyone has just as much right as I to say their piece here , I have not in any way excluded anyone in the way you seek to do with personal abuse... and I have explained REPEATEDLY that I am NOT religious, detailed the explanation , and stated that I do not seek to teach, preach, proselytise, convert or do any of those things religions do to condition, acquire, brain-wash their victims... I hate religion because it is EVIL- just as Jesus himself sad it would be by now... so you are MISTAKEN my frend, yet again, in everythng you made up, yet again, about me... more STRAWMEN as is your way ... and that is not discussion
wolfbird :The first few times around that was acceptable and tolerable. Now it has reached the stage of being abusive, offensive and invasive, IMO. But it is not my forum. It's up to either Dougald or the members themselves to decide what is to be done.
stranger: you are the abusive one my friend , senselessly abuusive about everything I write and offering no reason or discussion even of why , not listening to any explanations of your mistakes but ranting on as if nothing had been said... it is you who have clogged every thread with abuse of my commentaries instead of discussing them ...You are the problem wolfie my friend... if you stopped your personal abuse and simply discussed the points of discussion then the site would work fine for everyone, even you ...
Sorry Stranger, but I'm afraid you seem to be in a bit of a state. I hope you get some help.
Wolfbird, I salute your perseverance. I also appreciate your contributions to the forum (particularly enjoyed recent post on mythos/logos, and I look forward to watching the doc on the mathematicians). It would be lovely to see more folk contributing and engaging, but then I don't exactly add much myself. Never enough time in the day...
I guess like others before him, Stranger will get bored, run out of steam, move on.
Meanwhile, out in the world, Monday looks like being an interesting day: Warning of a stock market rout on Monday unless a eurozone rescue p...
I have never made such a claim, YOU invented the strawman ... and you are still attacking me, not discussing
"isn't it a more sophisticated version of what Dougald tried"
Yes, but then showing people the door (and opening it for them) is only a more sophisticated version of asking them to leave - but it makes it that much easier for them to actually go, because it stops them fighting over who should open the door!
If both people are blaming the other person for starting it, they'll both regard it as the other person's responsibility to start the ad hominem thread .... so it never gets started. But if someone else starts it, or points them to an existing one, they don't have that excuse. As long as one of them is sufficiently responsible to take the fight there (and refrain from answering in the original thread), then the other one will almost certainly follow. If you've got caught up in a contentious situation, it's very difficult to initiate the switch to engaging responsibly - but it's often fairly easy to follow if someone else initiates it.
I had a quick look at ning yesterday, and it does seem to support some user modification at code level. But it might even be possible already - I think it would be worth looking into.
It might work, but isn't it a more sophisticated version of what Dougald tried, when he rearranged the forum ? There was supposed to be a separate area for arguments. But if someone puts what amounts to spam, onto every topic, then the same arguments arise on every topic. The 'reply elsewhere' button would be good but would need someone to make one. I wonder if the ning people are able or willing to make adjustments and additions like that ?
Yes, I'll pursue it. I'll start by asking Dougald - maybe he'll say "oh yes, that's easy".
True enough. Yes, definitely worth looking into. Will you pursue it ?